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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:30:41 1998
From: Cynthia Stilley <cstilley@ns.flint.lib.mi.us>
Subject: global reach, local touch
Have any of you planned programs for library week using this theme?
Maybe we could do some collaboration here. Please reply to the list.
_____________________________________________________________________________
Cynthia S. Stilley (810) 232-7111 #234
Flint Public Library FAX: (810)232-8360
1026 E. Kearsley, cstilley@flint.lib.mi.us
Flint, MI 48502 http://www.flint.lib.mi.us/fpl.html
_____________________________________________________________________________
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:22:38 1998
From: Kirsten Edwards <kirstedw@kcls.org>
Subject: Re: Internet Access for Youth and Librarian Tolerance
On Tue, 6 Jan 1998, Filtering Facts wrote:
> We all censor in our jobs as librarians. None of you select
"Hustler" for
> your collections. And don't tell me it's because of economics, because as
> you remember, you were offered a free subscription. We all deliberately and
> consciously exclude whole classes of material because the content is
> offensive. We don't accomplish anything by trying to pretend that's not
> true. Censorship isn't a dirty word. Censorship, for lack of a better word,
> is good for libraries.
>
Oh for the love of Pete. You come into my libraries and FIND me some
shelf space - WITHOUT axing any of the (fewer than I'd like) magazines
I've got & I'll accept a free subscription to HUSTLER. Do you know how
many magazines I (and other) librarians turn down that we know our patrons
would want because there just isn't room? Are you aware how much a
new bookshelf would cost much less the building to find a place for it?
And for what it's worth, I have no problem with any individual or
privately supported library choosing to censor it's contents. But when
the government censors the documents - the materials - (Which is what you
want the public libraries to do) - it's contrary to the principles of
liberty and justice which it is pledged to support. It's wrong.
> rubbish to say otherwise. Ironic that the free speech absolutists are
> guilty of what they charge the religious right with, isn't it?
>
That's because the religious right & the far left are both ignoramouses
(sp?). I make moral choices every day. I expect other people to do the
same. ONE of those moral choices is to uphold the ethical principles of
my profession. The day I decide - or discover - that those principles
were in error, I'll find other work.
> It does take a village to raise a child, and librarians are a part of that
> village. All filtering say is "let's set a reasonable floor of
appropriate
> content by keeping the pornography that we would never select in paper or
> video out of the library's computers". When parents live in a
community
> where their children are protected from pornography, they have a right to
> ask that the library act similarly. That really isn't asking that much.
Are you aware that making "community standards" the rule for
abbrogating
ethical principals was used to defend the peculiar institution of slavery?
But...
We could get into some amusing discussions about what "children protected
from pornography" (amusing to me that is) actually means, but allow me
this proposal. What would you say, if a library offered ONE terminal,
obviously identified as the FILTERERD computer terminal, for people to use
if they wanted to? If the other terminals remained unfiltered and
identified as such.
Curious,
Kirsten Edwards (Who has no problem with right and wrong, if you're
willing to be rational about it)
kirstedw@kcls.org
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:25:52 1998
From: Kirsten Edwards <kirstedw@kcls.org>
Subject: Re: Adolescent "Recreational" Interests
On Wed, 7 Jan 1998 schachtc@lcm.macomb.lib.mi.us wrote:
> The
> question he poses is whether librarians should be obligated to assist
> them in accessing graphic images (not print) which child psychologists
> etc. might consider to be [potentially harmful and age innapropriate ie
> web sites featuring explicitly violent and or sexual content unless said
> young persons clearly have parental approval for such activities.
That's two things. First, if you have difficulities with the ethical
requirements of your chosen profession, and if you desire to be a moral
person, you will want to change professions. If you have difficulty
assisting a patron with offensive images (to you - BTW - these can
vary - I'm not in the least offended by naked bodies - it would be
irrational - though I'm aware they upset some people dreadfully) on
a regular basis, maybe public librarianship isn't for you. It can take
a strong stomach to comply with some requests for information/recreation
-al materials
But that's for adults. Second, you raise a very interesting point. If
child pyschologists or name-your-expert, had some proven type of image
that was definately harmful to children, why would parental permission
matter? I mean, parents generally are allowed to raise their children
pretty much as they like (and I couldn't see any of your patrons wanting
it otherwise) UP TO the point they begin to harm those children.... So
clearly there's something else going on here...
> How
> many of us would interloan a copy of that Madonna classic SEX for an
> interested 13 year old who thought it sounded like fun? Not a whole
> lot, I would wager; this is not a question of intellectual freedom; it
> is a matter of common
Shamefully, few enough would. Your common sense is another's silly
prudery. Sex is such a hot issue becasuse there simply isn't any
meta-level agreement about what constitutes right and wrong - BUT - I'll
stop here... I doubt any are interested. Let's give the classic
counter-example: "How many of us would interlibrary loan a copy of
that Harriet Tubman classic UNCLE TOM'S CABIN to an interested 13-year
-old who thought it sounded like fun? Not a whole lot....it's a matter
of common sense" --1850's southern librarian.....
> sense. Are we out campaigning in the streets and picketing movie
> theatres for violating the rights of Jr. High students by not letting
> them into R and NR movies? Nope. Why?
Because movie theatres are private concerns run, either by individuals or
corporations posing as same. If they don't bow to community pressures,
they lose revenue. Capitalism in action, folks. In the southern states,
during the depression, the scenes where Shirley Temple danced hand-in-
hand with Bo Jangles (black actor) had to be edited out. What private
individuals do is their choice. Our goverment needs to be above that.
> Because reasonably wise persons
> realized many years ago that exposure to lots of sex and violence wasn't
> good for growing kids, even though said young persons might be strongly
> attracted to them.
It's this portion of the question (rarely raised, so thanks) that troubles
me. What do we mean when we talk about "harmful to children"? What
kind
of harm? Do we know for sure? I think trading a known evil for a
possible evil is a mistake (Government censorship vs. "not good for
growing kids"). Do we even have probabilities? You argue graphic images
vs. text. Others have argued text harms kids. Then there was the comic
book scare lo these many years ago. I'd like to see some solid evidence
before I threw my constitutional protection out the door.
But having one filtered terminal available seems a possible compromise.
Not a great one, since it opens up some unfortunate legal cans of worms as
well as being a dangerous first step. But a possible one. After all, a
certain amount of catering to fools is acceptable. You know. It won't
work, it's a bad idea, but it IS your money...
Kirsten Edwards
kirstedw@kcls.org
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:28:00 1998
From: Angela Reynolds <ajrcm@teleport.com>
ubject: Filter Facts?
I hesistate to respond to Mr. Burt, but I cannot help myself. The
one simple fact that gets me every time in the pro-filtering arguement, is
that if those filters ONLY blocked true pornography (I realize there is a
fine line here) and nothing else I think more libraries might use them. Yes,
we use common sense and do not buy Hustler. But that is a choice, and one we
have control over, we CAN keep that out of our collections, it is one item.
(Besides, Hustler would not be a children's magazine anyhow.) With filters,
we have less control over what we keep out.
Now that I have spoken, I must comment on two other items this
discussion brings up for me: 1) If we just use those privacy screens,
which work pretty well, what does it matter what people are viewing? Don't
like it, don't stand behind them and spy.
2) What is the general opinion of offering ONE filtered terminal (in
addition to unfiltered ones) for those who want to use the filtered version?
(this is the solution our library is considering...we don't even have
internet for the public yet!)
******************************
Angela J. Reynolds
Youth Services Librarian
West Slope Community Library (Opinions, comments my own...)
Portland, OR
ajrcm@teleport.com
******************************
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:30:52 1998
From: "Tracey Firestone" <tfiresto@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Subject: Re: Internet training for children
Classroom Connect has a pre-packaged program for obtaining an "Internet
Drivers License." If you are interested in the details let me know. The
program includes a video, handouts and posters. It can be done with or
without the students having access to computers during the presentation.
Good luck,
Tracey Firestone
YA Specialist
Suffolk Cooperative Library System
Bellport, NY
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> From: Vollrath, Elizabeth <evollrat@uwsp.edu>
> To: 'PUBYAC' <pubyac@nysernet.org>
> Subject: Internet training for children
> Date: Wednesday, January 07, 1998 4:58 PM
>
> I know many of you have done Internet training for children. I would
> like to do a program for children (and their parents) on how to search
> the web, finding good sites for them, etc. Maybe issue an Internet
> "license" to the kids. Can any of you share any flyers, forms,
ideas,
> policies you have used? It would be greatly appreciated.
> Elizabeth Vollrath
> Portage County Public Library
> Stevens Pt., WI 54481
> evollrath@uwsp.edu
> (715)346-1290
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:30:59 1998
From: jmpietrb@infolink.org
Subject: author visits
Our library is considering having a young adult author come to speak
at our library. Has any other library, particularly in the
N.Y.-N.J.-area, had any young adult authors come to visit that they
were particularly pleased with? I'm wondering generally what a YA
author would charge and what is the procedure for scheduling an
author appearance. If anyone has some advice, please respond to:
JMPIETRB@Infolink.org. I have no experience in this area! Thanks,
Judy.
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:25:54 1998
From: Minero <Minero@aol.com>
Subject: Reach Out and Read suggestions
Greetings fellow librarians,
I have a very important project, and I want to get feedback from
professionals. I need as many of your comments and suggestions as you can
give me, as it is for a excellent cause. I am involved with a group
implementing the national program Reach Out and Read in our local area. If
you are not familiar with this program, it
1)promotes literacy 2)encourages parents to read to their children (across all
social and economic lines, only 50% of Americans read to their children, and
this has broad implications for later success with school and the development
of reading skills) 3)connects children who would never be exposed to books
with high quality, age appopriate literature--by the time a child starts
school, they will have a home library of ten picture books!
That is were you come in, Pubyacers. We have received vouchers for free books
from the national organization and have raised $2000 of local funding to
purchase books for kids--now the question is, which books? We will be giving
away 10 books at the 10 well-child check-ups every child has at the health
department, one age-appropriate book at each visit:
* one book to children 6 months old
* one book to children 1 year old
* one to children 1 and 1/2 old
* one to children 2 years old
* one to children 2 1/2 years old
* one to children 3 years old
* one to children 3 1/2 years old
* one to children 4 years old
* one to children 4 1/2 years old
* one to children 5 years of age
Keeping in mind 1) age appropriateness 2) cost--we want something available
in a paperback 3) this is our only chance to reach some children with magical
books, what book would you recommend for each age level? Also, we have
received over
1,000 copies of Dr. Seuss' <The Foot Book>, at which age level would you
plug
in that book? 4 of the titles have to be ordered from the Scholastic
Corporation, as we have vouchers for free books from them--they publish <The
Very Hungry Caterpillar> and some nice board books, such as <Good Morning
Baby>.
Have fun with this and send me some suggestions to Minero@aol.com, either one
or two titles or your whole "dream team" of ten books. I have some
ideas as
to what we could order, but I want to get a lot of feedback from you, as you
are seasoned and experienced professionals in this field. Thank you so much
in advance.
Maggie Bollar
Frankfort, KY
Minero@aol.com
502-223-1658
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:26:35 1998
From: "Ellysa S. Cahoy MBU (781) 270-1690 ext. 233" <cahoy@mvlc.lib.ma.us>
Subject: Sequel to Daddy's Roommate
I am wondering if anyone has heard anything about the new sequel to
_Daddy's Roommate_ by Michael Wilhoite. The sequel is titled _Daddy's
Wedding_.
Only one library in our large consortium has it, and I do not recall
seeing any reviews on it.
Can anyone give any personal reviews/feedback on _Daddy's Wedding_?
TIA
Ellysa Cahoy
Children's Librarian
Burlington (MA) Public Library
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:28:00 1998
From: Carol McHugh <camchugh@hillhouse.ckp.edu>
Subject: ML King, Jr. Websites
A few sites I am posting at our library:
http://www.seattletimes.com/mlk/
Holiday and educational information including an interactive quiz
link
http://www-leland.stanford.edu/group/King/
King Center, Atlanta - includes primary and secondary sources
http://www.webcorp.com/civilrights/mlk.htm
Sound samples of "I Have a Dream"
http://pathfinder.com/Life/mlk/mlk.html
Life magazine tribute with photo links
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:26:19 1998
From: "Kimberly Bears" <kimbat@hotmail.com>
Subject: Book Discussion Group
Hi David,
I just started a book discussion group this year with my 9-12 year olds,
and to my surprise it is going very well. I purchased 10 copies
(paperback) of each of the books that we are discussing (from October to
March) and kids register on a first-come, first-serve basis. If they
register for the program they get to keep the book. I have to say it
has been full EVERY time and then some. If the books are all gone, some
kids borrow the book from their school library just to participate in
the discussion.
The books we're discussing are taken from New Hampshire's Great Stone
Face Book Award reading list. (Our group is called the Great Stone Face
Book Brigade) If you're interested in seeing a copy of this list
let me know.
Anyway, we start off the discussion by listing our favorite characters
from the book, and telling why we liked/disliked them so much. The we
move on to some general questions about the book...
-What was your favorite scene? Why?
-Is there anything in the book that seemed unbelievable to you?
-Did you like/dislike the ending? Why?
Next, we move onto specific questions that relate to the book
itself...for example, when we discussed Lost In Cyberspace by Richard
Peck...
-Do you think that Josh's father decided to stay or go?
-If you could use your computer to travel back in time, where would you
go? Why?
I always involve myself in the discussion too. The kids seem to want to
know what I think as much as I want to know what they think. If I open
up, they seem to follow suit.
I always include an activity of some sort too. (A few times I didn't
need one as the discussion took up the entire hour) For example, I told
them if I could go back in time I'd go back and live in the story Little
House in the Big Woods because I loved the part where they made snow ice
cream. Then, I passed out a recipe for snow ice cream and they were
thrilled! At the end, we played hangman using computer related words
and used candy canes as prizes.
I will definitely continue this program next year. I hope to get a
local company to donate the funds to purchase the books too. I feel
that book discussion groups are coming back, and I wanted to be part of
all the excitement. I also think it's important to let the kids know
you're really interested in what they have to say. I demand respect for
eachother in the discussion. There are no right or wrong answers, and
everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion. So far, so good...
Good luck!
Kim Bears
************************************************************
Kim Bears Phone: (603) 432-1127
Head of Children's Services Fax: (603) 437-6610
Leach Library E-mail: kimbat@hotmail.com
276 Mammoth Road
Londonderry, NH 03053
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:32:29 1998
From: dorthybr@cadvantage.com (Dorothy M. Broderick)
ubject: Theological Clarification
I have received some personal messages from people who believed I
was attacking religion when I suggested that people whose primary goal is
to impose morality should go to schools of theology. That was not what I
was saying so, if there are others out there who feel the same way, let me
be more precise.
Librarians have a mission in our modern world to be as impartial as
humanly possible in developing collections. You may be a Christian
Scientist but you have to buy medical books; you may be a firm pacifist,
but you must buy books about war, you may be a libertarian, but you must
buy materials that applaud strong government, etc., etc., etc.
If some Sunday or Saturday or Friday night, you attended your place
of worship and the spiritual adviser announced that God was a really stupid
concept and all these beliefs and rituals were designed to keep you docile
and let the power brokers of the world control you, a la Marx, you would
not be very happy.
We were once told to render unto Caesar...Remember?
Let me tell you a true story. Back in the days before librarians
became professionals (do remember except for Chicago there were no graduate
library schools until after the end of WWII) my hometown library was run by
the Emeritus Congregational Minister who had gotten too old to be minister
but needed an income (also before Social Security gave elders dignity). Mr.
Meserve put those books about religion of which he approved in the 200s;
all others, including Catholicism, were in 398 as folk tales.
You might also want to know that the original Dewey subject heading
and classification for labor unions fell under the heading Crime and
Criminals.
I could go on, but won't. Just keep in mind that when librarians
forget, or in the case of some, never learn, their real mission, they move
very close to becoming tyrants. We've been there, done that. Times have
changed.
P.S. Susan M. is most likely a student at SUNY Buffalo since she's
not in the ALISE directory.
Dorothy M. Broderick
Dorothy M. Broderick Don't worry. Be crabby.
2025 Prairie Lane Maxine
Emporia, KS 66801
(316) 342-9277
(316) 342-6391 (also fax)
e-mail: dorthybr@cadvantage.com
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:32:41 1998
From: Jerri Garretson <jerri@spooky.manhattan.lib.ks.us>
ubject: Internet Access for Children
Several of us at our library have been following this discussion with
interest as I share PUBYAC posts with others on staff who are not
subscribers. We are having the same discussion among our own staff. One
of our assistant directors has agreed to my request to post her reaction to
the discussion:
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:39:27 -0600 (CST)
From: Judith Edelstein <jedel@spooky.manhattan.lib.ks.us>
To: Jerri Garretson <jerri@spooky.manhattan.lib.ks.us>
Subject: Re: Internet Access for Youth and Librarian Tolerance
Jerri - I feel compelled to set down some thoughts.
I have thought all along that David Burt makes sense and is a reasonable
voice on behalf of filters, but he has been reviled, if I remember
correctly, by Mary Kay Chelton and others.
The sad thing is that this debate has polarized like the abortion debate.
The children will be the losers when we are not able to find a reasonable
place of agreement between the two truths which underly the two sides of
the argument: A. That freedom of access is a noble right and needs to be
upheld, and that raising children in an open informed way is a value that
probably a majority of our society hold
vs. B. That adults have a responsibility for guiding children's
choices. (When children discover things we wouldn't lead them to, that is
a wonderful part of growing up -- finding the forbidden fruit. But that
does NOT excuse adults from the responsibility of guiding children's
choices.)
A and B are NOT diametrically opposite. It is possible to be
honestly dedicated to both at once -- difficult (because it requires
willingness and ability to discriminate) but possible, and certainly
called for in those who practice our profession and serve families and
children.
When Marian Wright Edelman spoke at ALA in Miami (1994) she exhorted
librarians to take care of the children and the audience was troubled by
the perceived conflict between defense of First Ammendment rights and that
call. We do not seem to have made progress since then.
The debate that has been waged in pubyac has been wonderful and I have
rejoiced in some of the eloquent statements in support of both sides. Can
I add my two cents.
I often think of the derivation of the word "education" -- from the
Latin
meaning "to lead forth, or out of." Educating our children means
leading
them out of the narrow confines of their selves, their unexamined values,
etc. -- and books have always been one of the best means for doing that.
In today's world, that means opportunities to explore the wealth of the
internet in ways that do not compromise the value of what is found there.
But the main root of the word is "leading" -- which, as I said above,
teachers/parents/librarians/other adult members of the village must do.
****************************************************************************
***
Judith Edelstein, Assistant Director for Services
MANHATTAN PUBLIC LIBRARY
629 Poyntz
Manhattan KS 66502
(785) 776-4741, ext. 129
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Jerri Garretson "Persist"
Head of Children's Services
Manhattan Public Library & North Central Kansas Libraries System
629 Poyntz Avenue
Manhattan KS 66502-6086
Email: jerri@manhattan.lib.ks.us
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:33:41 1998
From: Julie Albright - Central Services - Ventura Public Library Subject:
Censorship/D. Burt & Hustler
I believe there is a difference between censorship and deciding whether a
tacky item be included in a collection just because it's in print. A
qualified person making educated selection choices is not a censor. And
just because it's free, doesn't make Hustler any more shelf worthy.
Julie Albright, Children's Services, Ventura CA
vclsaj2@rain.org
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:37:40 1998
From: Minero <Minero@aol.com>
Subject: STUMPER
I have a patron (probably in her 30s) who remembers reading a book as a child:
an alligator or a crocodile lives in a big, old Victorian house with a lot of
other animals, and it floods...she says it's not one of the Lyle, Lyle
Crocodile books, and we checked through all the "alligator/crocodile"
books in
A to Zoo as well as all of the "flood" titles.
Thoughts on this matter?
Reply to Minero@aol.com
Thanks,
Maggie Bollar
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:37:42 1998
From: evette.signarowski@rpl.richmond.bc.ca (Evette Signarowski)
ubject: odds on oliver
My library recently received a request for reconsideration on the book Odds
on Oliver by Constance C. Greene. The patron stated that this book
contained too many stereotypical and negative images, particularly of
aboriginal people. I am part of a panel that will review the book, and I
would appreciate any input or reviews the collective wisdom of PUBYAC can
provide. Please email me directly. Thank you very much. Evette
Signarowski
________________________
Evette Signarowski
Steveston Public Library
4111 Moncton Street
Richmond, BC
V7E 3A8
Check out our website at www.rpl.richmond.bc.ca
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:37:47 1998
From: Leigh Bedford <lbedford@texas.net>
ubject: Books about Friendship
Could someone suggest some easy titles about friendship and acceptance of
diversity? I'm doing a storyhour to honor the ideals of MLK Jr and am
looking for good titles. I'm doing KEEPING UP WITH CHEETAH which is a great
story about a cheetah who at first rejects hippopatamus as a friend because
he so different, but then comes to realise just how good a friend hippo is.
But I need other titles as well. The titles need to be easy ones, my
storyhour has little kids in it.
Thanks!
Leigh
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From owner-pubyac@nysernet.org Thu Jan 8 22:37:50 1998
From: rdukelow@colosys.net (Rosemary Dukelow)
ubject: stumper- procrastination
Can anyone think of a story for a 3rd- 4th grader aobut time management or
procrastination? It's okay if the story is for a younger child. I found
Morgan and Me by Stephen Cosgrove and The Slowpoke Cure, a story in one of
the Mrs. Piggle-Wiggle books. Any ideas? Thanks for your help.
Rosemary rdukelow@colosys.net
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